acchikocchi (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
acchikocchi) wrote2009-10-03 03:17 pm
acchikocchi) wrote2009-10-03 03:17 pm
Entry tags:
the kpop edition
1. So give me the lowdown on SM Entertainment as a corporation. How do they recruit/train/market/etc., especially in comparison to JE? Info on shady business practices and lawsuits and things of that sort also welcome. XD ...How does the Korean music industry and market compare to the Japanese in general, actually? There is no such thing as tldr in comments here.
2. Favorite Korean artists/songs/albums/music videos? I am woefully ignorant. Pop, not pop, what have you - hit me. (Assume I know basically no one except Park Ji-yoon, since that's... true. Oh, and BoA.)
2. Favorite Korean artists/songs/albums/music videos? I am woefully ignorant. Pop, not pop, what have you - hit me. (Assume I know basically no one except Park Ji-yoon, since that's... true. Oh, and BoA.)
no subject
The kpop I like tends to embrace the latter, which is probably why a lot of YG artists' posturing about authenticity and timeless music leaves me cold.
Re: the trainee system, not sure if anyone's mentioned this yet, but Korean entertainment is still pretty much ruled by the chaebol system. If you do a little digging, you'll be shocked (saddened?) by how many "agencies" are really just boutique businesses of larger multinational corporations. For me what this points to is the kabuki of it all: the rivalries, the timed comebacks, the constant rumors of TV stations/companies boycotting the artists of this agency or another. When you follow the money, you see how closely intertwined nearly all the agencies are. I think that's very different from the japanese system, in the sense that (looking not just at idol agencies and the labels that release their work, but at music in general) the hierarchy appears vertical as "major-indie," rather than a hot mess of money and sex and payola.
Another something I found interesting: the images of agencies have come to be closely related with their most prominent producers. SM doesn't actually stand for Soo Man (its most prominent producer/director), but a lot of people assume it does. The LSM/Yoo Young Jin creative relationship has probably done more to shape SME's sound than anything else. That's both similar and not to Johnny's -- I think there *is* an identifiable Johnny's sound, but it's essentially a Swedish pop one.
Whereas Kpop borrows heavily (plagiarizes heavily, even) from the U.S., which is why I think it's at its best when it revels in the sheer temporality of fashion and pop. For example, the 4 Minute song has a line where they go "one, two, three, four, fooooouuur, four minute girl," which is hilarious and apt. Because *of course* they can't count to 5, or else as a group they're finished. The acerbic self-awareness of whoever is pulling their strings is really striking. If they'd released just that one song and then disappeared, I would have called them a genius concept group, but alas. Still around. :)
Links to song recs forthcoming. :) Also, does this mean you're officially crossing over (though not abandoning Johnny's, of course)?
song recs
After School - Play Girlz (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?e5zjmonzn25).
Son Dam Bi - Saturday Night (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?mcjjyzzjym0) is glorious, glorious synth pop. One of my favorite things about kpop is how when they do retro concepts, they pretty much just pick a random decade to describe their look, whether or not it fits. The music video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6nLg1WSgmc) is part studio 54, part disco, part '80s the way babies born in the '90s imagine it. And SDB is just an amazon compared to every other girl in the video, and it completely works.
SNSD - Gee (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?yzm1dzwmmhy) is another ridiculous pop song. Like, some people are singing at the void, and other people are in the void, and this song is basically a dwarf star of vacuousness and glossy irrelevance. So of course I think it's perfect.
SNSD - Boyfriend (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?zzfdgqmtmjy). The nasty thing about this song is the same thing that's icky about the Genie video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9dYLkmGuZs). You can be sex kittens or you can be little girls, but both? The little girl voices in this song give me the creeps, but I just pretend it's an ironic sendup of the ingenue, even though irony's never been their strong point.
2PM - Again & Again (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?oezgqtndzjm). One thing you can say about JYP's production is there's never a wasted note or beat. Everything is there for a reason (as opposed to LSM's broader, *and* the kitchen sink approach). I think this is easily 2PM's best song, and I love the violet scheme and club lights in the music video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BdgzuGRcULY). A little hip-pop, a little dance music, and I eat it up. :)
Brown Eyed Girls - Abracadabra (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?buqh5kmnmmi). BEG in general produce quality pop that doesn't sound overly American. I think when it comes to idol pop, you can tell which groups have handlers who really understand the aesthetic. MV (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9gZD26G38dc) and 2PM's parody (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=In4PkD1u6u0).
Lee Hyori - Hey Mr. Big (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?iwyttugmgxj)
Ivy - A ha.. (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?j2uqtnnzjyj)'s bassline sounds slightly dated, but I love the barely there percussion. And she's one of the few female pop singers I've heard who is really gifted at understatement.
Gumi - I'm Sorry (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?mmtkyyzmtoq).
4 Minute - HOT ISSUE (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?ejytkjyzmjg).
Big Bang - Lies (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?jrdajnwwmon) was among several songs cribbing from tecktonik, but it's the one that remains in popular consciousness. You can trace the ancestry, abbreviated as it is, from this song to the current pop being produced. So it's really too bad it's fruit from a poisoned tree -- the borrowing from freetempo is excessive and the timbaland synthesizers are slightly embarrassing. Still.
U-KISS - Talk to Me (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?orwhjniwhdf) is ridiculous mid-90s pop.
SHINee - Forever or Never (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?ntw2yynydv0) (cover).
AJ - Dancing Shoes (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?kuyzyij22fm)
Uhm Jung Hwa - D.I.S.C.O. (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?oo0zdn5uywz)
Taeyang - Look Only At Me (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?4tyyy2jc0gj). I have serious reservations about this song and Big Bang in general, but the lyrics are tight, and I like the counterplay of the main vocals and the secondary ones.
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In what sense? That is, in Japanese culture you have the terms S and M thrown around all the time - to label personality types or at least image types (in terms of interactions on camera) especially - but somehow I don't think that's what you're getting at? *g*
Re: chaebol: I only had the vaguest notion of how the chaebol system worked before, but even a quick Wiki-ing is enlightening. Fascinating to read, and the comparison to the keiretsu system is especially helpful to me since again, that's just what I'm more familiar with. Chaebol seem more akin in several ways to zaibatsu, though, which is in line with their respective timelines. So take the big talent agencies - SM, YG, etc. - do you mean they're part of a larger group, or are they at the top of the tier controlling everyone else? Just how transparent is all this, anyway? (I'm doing my best to poke around online instead of just inundating you with questions, sorry!) If you have any articles and write-ups you'd rather point me at than answer my every question, that's more than fine. :)
Incidentally, this is all exactly - exactly - what I'm trying to get a finger on. That's what still fascinates me about Johnny's, too - placing the faces and personalities and nutty concerts we know and love in the context of the massive looming shadow behind them, ahaha.
Ah, I totally did think SM stood for Soo Man when I first found out his name, whoops. *g* So I take it that these groups don't outsource their composing overseas as much? (You are completely on the money about the Johnny's sound. Did you catch the interview in the Japan Times with one of the major songwriters for JE, by the way? The two Swedish songwriters in that one documentary write a lot for NEWS, the quartet behind Shuuji to Akira was Swedish - but this guy's songs go mainly to KAT-TUN and he's an American from NY/LA. I should take a look at, say, Kanjani8's songwriting credits sometime. They're probably actually Japanese.)
Because *of course* they can't count to 5, or else as a group they're finished.
eep, you lost me here, sorry! *dies* Why 5...?
Also, does this mean you're officially crossing over (though not abandoning Johnny's, of course)?
I danced around this in the post itself but have no qualms admitting it in comments. Yup, they've got me at last. XD Not that I didn't appreciate individual songs or artists (okay, namely the two mentioned in the post) before this, but I wasn't at all interested in anyone as people, or the overall scope of things. And I was so convinced that I'd never look at it from a fannish perspective because I was too chicken to leave my (Japanese) linguistic-and-cultural-understanding bubble! How are the mighty fallen. XD *regrets nothing*
As far as Johnny's goes, I'm keeping an eye on them still (and I'm signed up for the annual
fit of masochismend of the year fic exchange as well, haha, so I'd better not be bailing out any time soon), but I've been restless and ready for fresh meat for a while now. So to speak. For the last few months I've been revisiting old fandoms and checking out what's been going on there since whenever I was last around, but I was basically ripe for the picking. *g*no subject
That fetish carries over into Korean pop music especially with drama MVs. Like the ending of these linked MVs (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_8w1QgorDw), or this MV (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zL08L96wxyE), or this MV where he basically gets shot in the head (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOKl1jhR5NA). And so on.
Re: the chaebols, the agencies are definitely not at the top. In fact, I'd hazard a guess that all of them operate eternally in the red, with maybe the exception of JYP. It costs so much money to buy songs, to stage them, to film MVs, to do PR, to (ahem) grease palms. One of the most interesting things that came out of TVXQ's lawsuit was SME's assertion that they'd actually lost money in the time since TVXQ debuted (the false implication being it was the group's fault). You have to join the comm, but someone also posted a financial report on SME (http://community.livejournal.com/dbsg/3934520.html#cutid1) back when the lawsuit mess started.
How the agencies are connected is hard to straighten out, but here's an example: Shinhwa was one of SME's first and most popular boybands, but after some wank, they jumped ship in 2003 to Good Entertainment, an agency that (miracle of miracles!) was also founded in 2003 by CJ Entertainment, one of the most powerful entertainment conglomerates in Korea. CJ Entertainment, btw, owns properties such as M.Net (a channel with some bad blood between it and YGE). Good Entertainment is also connected to JYP -- when one of the original members quit Wonder Girls, GE sent over Yoobin to JYP. Incidentally, that member who quit WG is now the leader of her own Cube Entertainment group, 4 Minute. Cube Entertainment is a sister company of JYPE, much like M-Boat (which used to have Wheesung and Big Mama) was a sister company of YGE. And everywhere in between is CJ Entertainment and the massive clout they have in Korea, especially taking into consideration their film companies and ownership of CGV.
Re: outsourcing, it's complex. The big three have their founding producers (Lee Soo Man, YG, JYP). As SME and YGE send more and more feelers out internationally, they've started buying the rights to more and more songs written by non-Koreans (as opposed to, ahem, borrowing without asking). An astonishing number of the songs from SHINee's first album were essentially remakes. I think that's just economics -- cheaper to buy the rights to a song for a certain country/language than to buy them all together (which is what SME did for SNSD's Genie). But that's not necessarily the case for JYP, likely because he actually is sort of an international producer, having worked with Will Smith and Cassie and the like. He's also the only Big 3 producer who speaks fluent English. For SME this is all a source of potential identity-loss danger; they're known for those LSM/Yoo Young Jin collaborations (collectively known as SMP), from the days of H.O.T up through Super Junior. They seem to be handling it with aplomb; "SORRY, SORRY" is, after all, a thoroughly updated SMP song from YYJ.
"5" because the group is called 4 Minute. :)
Well, tons of Kpop idols head over to Korea, so there'll be lots of source material you don't need translations for? And welcome to Kpop; it's insane and so is a lot of its fandom, but it's still a lot of fun.
no subject
+ AllKpop.com (http://www.allkpop.com/) is one of the most popular news/gossip/opinion sites, and it's populated with cavemen, cretins, misogynists and idiots. Still, they have a close relationship with MTV Iggy, so it's one of the best places to find out about Kpop related stuff going on Stateside.
+ Seoulbeats (http://www.seoulbeats.com/) is a faux-gressive kpop news site; they pretend to be the PC version of AllKpop, but they're pretty much as shallow, narrowminded and transphobic as the writers over at AK. It's unfortunate, considering how much genderbending and androgyny there is in Kpop right now, and really, you'd think David Bowie and his ilk never happened or something, given how often they pull out the fainting couch for any girls acting too boyish or boys acting too femme. Still, they're probably #1 and #2 for kpop news and opinions.
+ You'll see 2OD get mentioned if you're into 2PM/2AM. It's referring to the forums (http://www.2oneday.com/) here, as well as its infamous twitter here (http://twitter.com/Twooneday).
+ I really prefer Angry Asian Man (http://www.angryasianman.com/angry.html) for pop culture news, but he almost never covers Kpop except when it goes to the U.S. a la BoA. Too bad, because he seems like such a decent, intelligent and thoughtful guy.
+ Korea Pop Wars (http://www.koreapopwars.com/) is a great resource for all things business-related to Kpop.
+ Korea Gig Guide (http://www.koreagigguide.com/) is a great website for following Korean indie music, if you ever want to dip your toes into the rock side of things.
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And I see CJ Entertainment belongs to CJ Corporation, which was spun off of Samsung and keeps "very close ties to this day". I just bet. Wow, this is the sort of thing that is endlessly fascinating to me. *dies* Must research further. All we're missing is a little organized crime.
I was thinking of mentioning a couple of the especially helpful threads here another post - do you mind if I include this one or would you rather not have it singled out? Totally understand if that's the case. :)
Oh, and thank you for the links below, especially the business and indie links! :D
no subject
Well, speaking organized of organized crime... (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jang_Ja-yeon) I really, really wouldn't be surprised if most of these agencies ended up having ties to crime orgs. Not that we need the extra layer of sleaze -- in a strange way, the agencies themselves form their own kind of underworld. And we still don't know what happened with Kim Sung-hoon, the man referenced in Jang Ja Yeon's wiki entry.
I'd actually prefer not to have attention called, but if you wanted to quote part of our discussion without attribution, that'd be fine with me. :)
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That works perfectly well, too, thanks. :D